corner weights for dirt oval racing

Ok sounds good. You should also complete this process with approximately the amount of gas with which you will be racing. PDF iRacing Set-up Guide While several different setup parameters could have caused this situation, a likely cause is excessivecross-weight. 4 Things You Should Never Do In A Front-Wheel Drive Car knew I needed to put the car on the scales. The only way to change static weight is to physically move weight or ballast in the car. Even on a track with mostly right-hand turns, the problem in the left-hand turns costs a lot of time. To test this, put the car on scales, and just tip the setup board and see how much the numbers change. intentionally favor a turn direction. I was surprised to find, contrary to my experience, that the Vette came is very close to itsexpected weight as soon as it was let down on the scales, without having to take bind out of the suspension. Dirt track racing in Australia has a history dating back to the 1920s and 1930s. How NASCAR Wedge Adjustments Work | HowStuffWorks This allows a slightly lower rear stance, which provides a good weight transfer entering a corner. Positive Caster is created when the caster line lands forward of the contact patch. That seem like a lot. You can estimate your car's center of gravity Examine a modern push/pull rod suspension, particularly if it uses a crank link to transformthe Would be interesting to see how close to ideal I got it though, given how well it handles already. You can lower the cross weight to help on tacky tracks. lowered onto the scales the tires will need to spread out to unbind the difference that made. the front ramps then jack up the rear and lower it onto the rear scales. I recommend adding an eighth or slightly more to the lowest corner just to make sure you pass tech. , Left Rear = Conversely, if the car feels tight throughout the corner, raise both track bars. %, Bite = 2 1/2 turns. Using dead struts and lots of bearings will help. in left hand turns than in right turns. Cross weighting is crap for road courses and only applies to turning one direction OR if the car is about 50/50 F/R weight to begin with. Shock Angle-measure the angle of the shock installed and at ride height. You need a nice, flat and level surface for the scales. TVW CWP FWP or, 2,800 0.52 0.51 = 685B. Interested in hearing peoples' opinions and (preferably) experiences. Right Front weight: Left Rear weight: Yeah, I'm a little puzzled by my result when I let me car down on my new scales as well. Make sure the vehicle is loaded with driver, passenger, and cargo just like you will drive it or . It is possible that their circuitry uses a high capacitance value to smooth out the signal or slow it down. R. racing junky Member. 3. Prepare the car. Jacking weight will not alter the left side or the rear percentages. can help us get our setup right with less testing. Weight Distribution Theory | Bob's 4 Cycle Karting weights: Corner Weight Calculator if For ovals we want a First off, you must maintain the legal ride height to pass tech. Whats your SETUPS Dirt Track Racers? - Racing Forum - j-body 11. split the adjustment between all four wheels--extend the LF and RR 1 1/4 turns Before putting your car on the scales you need to power up Maybe I'm over-thinking this, but I was amazed when I got my new scales, and let my car down on them for the first time. At the right rear, a quarter-inch change in the height of the end of the link will change the angle and can make an asphalt car undriveable. For example, if your initial setup is 52 percent cross-weight, and you want 50 percent cross-weight, lowering the right front or left rear corner will decrease cross-weight percentage. Your car may be designed to run different ride heights than these. Just follow the steps and you can set the pre-load in the fixture to where it will be very close in the car. RC Dirt Oval Basic Setup & Tuning Guide (21.5, dirt oval, GFRP, Custom Works, Purpose Built) - YouTube 0:00 / 43:10 Dirt Oval Setup & Tuning Tutorials RC Dirt Oval Basic Setup &. The proper progression for these two parameters is to establish ride height first and then set the corner weights, which comes down to setting the crossweight. Upgrade fluid and/or cool. about 1/8" of wheel movement) to reduce the weight on the right front and left Plus it sounds like street and autocross pressures are about the same stagger front to rear, so it really shouldn't have a noteworthy impact. camber angle of the wheels (-3.5 front, -3 rear). 1. On oval track cars, cross-weight is usually used in conjunction with stagger (where the right rear tire is larger in circumference than the left rear tire) to balance handling. 3 To make changes to establish the crossweight percent, we scale the car and record the crossweight percent. Do this by making equal changes to the adjusters on each side. As long as the tires have near "1 to 1 traction" with the ground, you should set up your race car like an asphalt car (see the Chassis Set-up At The Rear For Cornering page). However, you can choose to use them. The left rear link angles are less critical because that corner moves much less than the right side on asphalt cars. difficult to position all 4 scales so you can just drive up on all of them at document your current ride heights and your coil over changes each time (TVW FWP) - RF = 743C. Oval Track. Oval Muscle Car. However, most importantly you need to take care of the handling. Disconnect and adjust later. How To Be Fast With Front-Wheel Drive: An Expert Explains - Jalopnik (Right Front + Left Rear) / (Left Front + Right Rear), When balanced the Cross Weight % will = 50%. Make small changes at the track, and make only one change at a time. They are not too suitable for racing and oval dirt cars. W. William18 New member. Corner Weight: (1/2 the front or rear weight) Use an accurate racecar scale that will weigh each corner of your car. LF coil over 5 turns. When dealing with advanced suspension tuning, some people may adjust the corner weights in a manner to impact the way the car handles based on the tracks layout. pounds of preload to the scale weights. % 50% is optimal, Wedge = Jun 7, 2018 #5 . The situation isfrustrating. weights and percentages and generates target wheel weights to achieve a 50% In circle track racing, we often, and almost always, have different rate springs on each corner of the car. You can use rubber tires on very specific tracks and seasons. on each wheel to speed shock adjustment. Moving weight to the front of the kart will provide more front-end grip. I put the tiles on top of the scales. . 50% then Wedge Delta will be 0. over 10. Hot Rod. Took it to be corner weighted and it transformed the car in to a front runner that the drivers raved about. When looking at corner weighting, the cross weight (diagonal weight) is the most important component. The Circle Track Analyzer is a computer program that simulates most any car you can design, racing on most any size oval track. We had a good Miataset up for ST. The SRM will determine the relative changes to the spring height adjusters for weight changes. (TVW LSP) - LF = 769D. How to Properly Use a Penske Shock Tuning Guide to Optimize Your much Wedge Delta and make the handling worse. All of these measurements are widened by the Only after I spent a lot of time bouncing on the door sills did it settle down and stabilize. The tiles I the sway bars because they fail so often and the bars only added a couple of It also helps when shaking the car to take the bind out of the linkages. This gets very tedious, given the number of iterations it typically takes to get the corner weights right. We use our multiplier to move each adjuster so that the preload changes are equal and the ride height will remain close to the same. One of the most important aspects of racing is having a good handling balance. balancing see my corner balance how-to and Vehicle Scales | Corner Weight Race Car Scales - Speedway Motors the scales and zero them with no weight on them. Once the corner can help us get our setup right with less testing. Motor: 550 or 540 motors only. Cross weight and left side work backwards in terms of adjustment. Guess I have to try it. Set them to hot pressures is the norm as I understand it. Many successful race teams use corner weighting to achieve the same F/R % on both sides equal, not cross weight. You've tried springs, shocks, different bars, neutralizing the anti-roll bar, and nothing seems to work. If most of the important turns on your . This is my 2001 S2000 with 1/2 tank gas, 216 3. It seems to me that if there's bind in the suspension that's preventing all the force of the springs to come into play, the weight read by the scales will be less than the correct value. Andy Hollis does this. Make sure the floor is perfectly level; use shims under the scale pads if needed. Corner-Weight Distribution Bickel points out that corner-weight distribution refers to the amount of weight carried by diagonally opposed pairs of wheels. 4m.net - The Most Opinionated Racing Message Board In The Universe. If you want to lower the front of the car then retract only With the stock setup the car should have more grip Disconnect the sway bar. I guess I should work on losing weight personally (i am 220~). Dirt Track Chassis Set-up At The Rear For Cornering - Auto-Ware Search for: If the driver lifts early but still has a fairly good amount of roll speed into the corner, there probably isn't much brake being used. LR = left rear. Cross weights can be changed by making ride height adjustments to the coil-over suspension by either winding the lower spring platform up or down. stiff springs on your coil overs. Once you have established an ideal moment center design and the correct cambers through testing, you need to maintain those throughout your season. unbalanced--it will turn better in one direction than in the other (all other Put the car on ride height blocks without the shocks in the car and then measure the shock length from center of bolt to center of bolt. I race in a spec class, so everyone is using the same equipment. On oval track cars, cross-weight is usually used in conjunction with stagger (where the right rear tire is larger in circumference than the left rear tire) to balance handling. I gave up on running adjustable end links on As the shopping cart is pushed forward the front wheels spin back and trail behind the caster line. The cosine of 18 degrees is 0.95106, and that into 1.0 is 1.05146. If the car feels loose throughout the corner, lower both track bars evenly. At the front, we will move the LF and RF adjusters up by 0.0625-inch. After these items are completed, it is necessary to corner weight the car. It will let you predict and understand the effects that various modifications have on handling, performance and lap times. You will need to weight your vehicle on each tire to use this tool. Take the total weight of the car in the configuration you decide on, with driver or without, and to find the corners, do the following: TVW = Total Vehicle Weight = 2,800, LSP = left side. springs settled over the first 3 months. front left and You will have to repeat this every time you lower the car onto Left Rear tire is carrying more weight so it will get more traction and Maybe there's some sort of bind in the scales. I rear and tried again but I still needed more weight off the right front and left This is but one method and I encourage everyone to ask around and find a method that works for your type of car, this one may not be the most efficient. The more rear weight bias, the tighter the chassis will be coming out of a turn. Now that we have the front-to-rear rake set, we adjust the side-to-side rake. want balanced turning in both directions. We were racing dirt oval about a month ago, and then I tried this scale system . need to roll the car back and forth a few inches several times, being careful Those will tend to reduce friction and bind at the expense of NVH and added wear. cross weight - iRacing.com Wiki racers discovered they could insert an actual wedge into the left rear in the driver's seat to load the suspension. Typical racing scales will calculate this for you automatically, but you can rig up something that will work using a single scale and 3 equal sized spacers to get a good estimate. Now that we have established the ride heights, our weights could be anywhere. My shocks are double adjustable, as many will be when at this level of prep. Intercomp 102030 5X5 Hub-Mounted Corner Weight Scale. Always record the cross-weights and ride heights for reference at the race track in case changes are needed. The total weight will ALWAYS be correct unless you can find some way to suspend gravity, if you can let me know. Go in hard, let off and let the drag brake pivot the car, and get right back on the throttle. I used a laser level to project a horizontal "Springs and chassis components can be adjusted to push down on one rear wheel," Bickel said. you weigh and adjust. The more power a car has, the more that static weight over the drive wheels helps acceleration off the corners. How to Adjust iRacing Sprint Car Cross Weight AKA Wedge adjustments were 1 turn to the right front and 3/4 turn to the left rear. Rethink Dirt: Advanced Dirt Track Theory | Hyper Racing Even 1/8 inch difference will make a difference, especially if you have If you want to raise the front of the car then extend only the close to where I wanted it. center of gravity (CG) height by using this page: We do this by jacking weight into, or adding preload to, the RF spring and the LR spring. Bite = Left Rear - Right Rear and a positive value means the It changed the wheel weights by 10 pounds at each wheel: I finally went too far when I took two turns off the Right Front (went Youre always going to have some friction, especially depending on the type of suspension used. you run on the track. Iretighten them after I've made all my adjustments. It would just automatically settle. Here's how we find the multipliers. Setting static weight distribution and adjusting cross-weight percentage is one way to assure good handling. Corner weighting your car is This adds pressure to that end of the car just like putting the paper wedge underneath the table leg. The fact about this concept is when you put a softer right rear bar in, the car rolls more to the right rear but it is actually transferring less weight. Open timing on motor and esc. A 50% Cross Weight will yield a balanced handling car, one the scales. Mudboss Setup #3 - Traxxas Slash transmission setup and diff - YouTube will help with those turns. The third, and probably the best, option seems to be to invest in a set of hub stands, as this not only takes care of the bind issues via their built-in rollers, but it just makes the task of doing the alignment a lot simpler as well. 3) Reverse stagger: The opposite of stagger when your left side tires are . 1 of the section on "Adjusting The Corner Weights," and that is 685. 2) Stagger: Stagger is how much bigger the right side tires are compared to the left side tires. I always thought it was the other way, shock travel was increased in order to have more movement for better control over the suspension? It turns out my car has a very close to 50/50 weight distribution so I never noticed that it was actually recommending corner weights that satisfyLF/LR = RF/RR! It's the effective distribution that changes when you have suspension bind. To increase rear weight, move weight as far back as possible. My car has solid/spherical bushings everywhere, so there should be very little bind from them. The outer rear tire drives "around" the outer front tire, allowing the chassis to efficiently turn into the corner because the rear tire Since the front and rear shocks are of different lengths you I overshot by a little so I raised the left rear spring perch by 1/2 each and retract the RF (Right Front) and LR 1 1/4 turns each. Measure control arm angles after each change. Corner Balance - Rob Robinette end-link into the anti-roll bar's hole. Corner weights and chassis balancing - R/C Tech Forums upgrading our street stock suspension part 2 the rear end. Take your shock, compute the spring preload, and compress the shock/spring combo to the installed spring height in your spring rate fixture. Dirt oval racing tips/ Go karts - Don Terrill's Speed-Talk So let's study ride heights first. Get it right and your car launches down the corner, hits that hard hairpin just right and holds the corner at full throttle. If you had a car with a fully rod-ended out suspension that frictionless and frictionless tires you wouldn't need to roll the car around or bounce it or anything. Setup Tips for Asphalt Oval Racing I've actually lowered a miata a decent amount just by forcing the bushings around. I will say that if I'm starting on a fresh setup, or the car has been lowered, or I find myself making massive spring perch changes, then I will loosen all of the suspension bolts so that the bushings can relax and find their new happy place. Setting Ride Height & Corner Weight - Circle Track Magazine - MotorTrend Forum Actions: Forum Statistics: Threads: 167; Posts: 1,367; Last Post: . Can do to just left sidesor right sides, or to all 4. what he means is he's adding weight to the left rear and right front g) Oval track and road racers use slightly different vocabularies to describe the adjustments made to their cars and the effects these adjustments have on the car's handling. Understanding corner weights | Articles | Grassroots Motorsports Adjust the rear down by using the same method as in No. Right handers vs left handers feel quite a bit different-I run out of suspension on right handers much more often, and on left handers the car loves having me hanging out over the inside of the contact patches working the corner. Make sure under all conditions that you will have at least minimum ride heights. Comet Kart Sales - Karting 101 - Getting Started in Kart Racing In order for the table to stand steady, all four legs should be of equal length, and as a consequence each will apply equal pressure on the floor. Softer Right Front and Right Rear Springs 10 lbs at a time Car Loose at Corner Exit Reduce stagger rear tires Raise the Front ride Height Move the Right rear tire in. To favor right turns, put more weight on the So, we are not reinventing the wheel here, just refining the process. Take the total weight of the car in the configuration you decide on, with driver or without, and to find the corners, do the following: TVW = Total Vehicle Weight = 2,800, LSP = left side weight percent = 0.54, FWP = front weight percent = 0.51, CWP = Crossweight percent = 0.52. racers discovered they could insert an actual wedge into the left rear A. links then disconnect them for the corner balance. What Spring Rates To Use In Your Race Car - MotorTrend "If your car is really tight or really loose during hot laps, you have to take a look at the things that are going to make the biggest difference. If the diff spins at 200rpm and the car is going straight, both wheels spin at 200rpm. Choose a level spot in your setup area. the front ramps then jack up the rear and lower it onto the rear scales. Proforms are cheap scales. Here are some points to remember when weighing your race car: How to renovate an old mill | Making stuff: Part 6, Tech tips | Understanding fender rolling, downsizing tires, wheel spacers and what makes a race wheel, How to build a splitter for only $100 | Against the wind: Part 3. I have a 96 civic with a d16/manual. 2 coils cut off springs 4 corners. Now that we understand why we need to maintain a set ride height, let's go through an example of how to set ride height. Any press releases or advertising will be deleted. cross weight. 5 So, five rounds in the right-side springs (along with the corresponding Multiplier to the left-side springs) changes the crossweight percent by 5.6 percent, which is 1.12 percent per round, or 0.89 rounds per percent of crossweight. Rebound adjustments will allow you to alter your car to a corner entry condition without affecting corner exit or vice versa. To properly corner weight the car, it is necessary to add weight to the driver's seat which is approximately equal to the weight of the driver (or have the driver sit in the car). important for oval racers, especially on dirt ovals. 14. So if you have 60% on the front , you should have 30% on each front wheel. right swapped). For road racing and autocrossing, the ideal left weight percentage is 50 percent. Speaking of springs, it's a good idea May run 4 pole motors. Step 1 - Determine Sprung Weight. As for setting the left side and right side equal, I understandthe reason why it might be best, but hard for me to picture how to adjust it. If you want more turn in one direction put extra weight into the inside rear or outside front. T-Bucket . Carry some in your tool kit and buy tarus wheel studs if you want a dirt cheap slightly longer wheel stud to have more safety. Because we desire 52 percent, we will need to increase the crossweight percent. 57.5" front and 59.625" rear. Bite should be positive for oval racing, Wedge = car for a week to let the suspension settle: I decided to disconnect the front and rear sway bars to see what 12. The tiles & salt seemed to help because the weight never Do youhave recommendations for such corner weight percentages? I commented on this to the youtubevideo on TIG welding, where they put their C5 Vette on scales and had a contest to guess the weight correctly, so I apologize for the duplicate posts. The overall effect is much like having no shock in the equation. We delve deeper into race suspension tuning basics here. A place where you can add in your Photo Galleries. The angles are another way to set the suspension for the desired ride height and cross-weight percentage. The height of the rear roll center (and the front also) is critical to handling. I'm not saying you get what you pay for with race scales but there is a reason I went with longacre. Calculate the spring rate multiples. How To Understand Differentials - RC Car Action RC Dirt Oval Car Setup & Tuning Guide [5 Key Steps] values shown below are totally fictional. Right Front tires. Leebo's Corner. B. For pure race cars this isnt a consideration. Intercomp SW500 EZ Weigh Scales. Record each spring rate. If we remember, or record this number, then we can easily make changes in the future to get to our intended crossweight percent fast and easy. And I cannot really move any weight around. This spreadsheet will also give you an estimated center of gravity height if This article explains everything pretty clearly and I feel like I could tackle the job myself now! Once you get the car up on the scales you'll rear. Minimizing the hysteresis is good, but it also minimizes the shock/spring contribution to effective 'at the wheel' unprung weight (mass). Sprint kart classes are broken down into driver's age, engine package, and total vehicle/driver weight. Let's explore some ways to do this in an orderly and sensible way. In our example, move the LR and RR corners down by 0.4375-inch. retract the right rear tire which puts more weight on the Left Rear and I use 2x6 wood planks as ramps to drive the car onto There are several ways race teams adjust corner weight. Once the corner balance is complete put someone in started with the Left Front because I wanted to raise the ride height of the car The Science Behind Dirt Late Model Suspension Setup To increase left-side weight, move weight as far to the left as possible. That is why a stiffer right rear spring makes the car looser. line above each scale and placed a ruler on the top I've spent an hour this afternoon trying to do corner weights "on the cheap" using our IKEA kitchen scale (cost - 15.99 a few years ago) and three wooden blocks cut to the same height as the scale (38mm). to balance your car in one big step. Moving or removing weight is one Replacing a heavy battery with a light weight one allowed me to get close . You're better off not corner balancing the car than doing it on an unlevel turn to the RF simply to raise the ride height of the front of the car. Wedge is a term used in the RC Dirt Oval Basic Setup & Tuning Guide (21.5, dirt oval - YouTube Weight can be moved around at the track to fine tune the handling characteristics of the chassis. I primarily just making sure it meets class mininum weight, but I may mess with the balance if its off by much, but I dont think it is. more traction or bite in left turns. I use this technique and it Plan to win in a repeatable fashion. Dirt or asphalt? Toe inn a 1/4 inch. Don't be in a hurry to set ride Changing the amount of weight on each corner will change how the kart handles in a turn. Thanks. Bite tells us how much we Measuring from the center of the tires I got In our example it is 18 degrees. Right Front = Of course you can add too

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